Capcom Fighting Evolution get's a 6.5!

[Agozer]

There is one tune in CVS2 that I like. The bg with the double decker

And another with the massive beer mug

Heeeyyy, those are my favorite tracks too! I also like the BGM of the Africa stage.

 

I like it when the announcer says "Keep rockin' baby". That's so badass.

[shin_nihon_kikaku]

shin_nihon_kikaku Posted Today, 12:48 PM

  I told you when it was first announced that this game would suck ass and you were all falling over yourselves to defend it.

 

Still, now it's got a review score you believe it? Reviews should never be taken as gospel. I have little to no respect for game journalists, they don't understand the first thing about the subject matter.

 

My my, you have been bitchy lately, haven't you? always trying to prove us wrong and show us up...

 

We defended CFE against YOUR baseless attacks which you launched before you had ever played the game. Again you stereotype all reviewers and say they "don't understand" the subject matter - a ridiculous accusation. You are on a high-horse preaching about videogames from the point of view of "design concepts" and you don't understand the "art for the sake of art" or "labors of love" that are MGS2 and certainly CFE.

 

What kind of a game designer are you anyway? In the MGS2 review your discussion of your post seems less like an official position and more like 1 angry guy with twisted ideas. What company do you even work for - if any?

 

In short, don't antagonize us by trying to prove your superiority - we do hit back. Bring it on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

"Before I had ever played the game"? I don't need to play something to know whether or not it's going to be crap. Case in point - CFE. There are plenty of things that can be used to ascertain the quality of something, without having to spend four hours with it first. As for game magazines, I've never needed to take the advice of a

game review since I was about 7. By relying on my own intuition, I've never bought a poor game yet. How do you explain that? In fact it's the other way around. Any crap I've bought has been the magazines' fault. On the odd occasion I've punted on something (that I wouldn't have otherwise touched) based on all-round high review scores, I was right. Halo = 10 out of 10, Burnout 3 = 9 out of 10? Gimme a friggin' break...Game journalists = Absolute cretins.

 

You want to defend the press? Of course, they are fine when they are merely reporting on news, events and press releases, it’s when they attempt to think that it all goes downhill.

The best we have to offer in the west is ‘Edge’. Many gamers are apparently amazed at Edge magazine’s ‘insights’. In reality, much of its content is total tripe, regardless of the fact that it’s well-written. Edge hides the inadequacies it shares with all other games magazines behind its use of the written word. And to good effect. People will believe anything if its interspersed with a few adjectives they don’t understand.

 

Just because you cannot see how game journalists are wrong 90 percent of the time and that their opinions are almost exclusively ‘utter bullsh*t’ doesn’t mean nobody else can.

 

I don't expect for a second that you could understand what's wrong with MGS2 or anything else that's been over-rated beyond belief by the totally ignorant press. You have NO idea what it’s like to see the industry the way I do….oh wait… yes you do…you are on a forum……If I have no respect for professional game journalists how much respect do you think I reserve for people like you?

Edited November 30, 2004 by shin_nihon_kikaku

[Daeval]

shin_nihon_kikaku Posted Today, 12:48 PM

  I told you when it was first announced that this game would suck ass and you were all falling over yourselves to defend it.

 

Still, now it's got a review score you believe it? Reviews should never be taken as gospel. I have little to no respect for game journalists, they don't understand the first thing about the subject matter.

 

My my, you have been bitchy lately, haven't you? always trying to prove us wrong and show us up...

 

We defended CFE against YOUR baseless attacks which you launched before you had ever played the game. Again you stereotype all reviewers and say they "don't understand" the subject matter - a ridiculous accusation. You are on a high-horse preaching about videogames from the point of view of "design concepts" and you don't understand the "art for the sake of art" or "labors of love" that are MGS2 and certainly CFE.

 

What kind of a game designer are you anyway? In the MGS2 review your discussion of your post seems less like an official position and more like 1 angry guy with twisted ideas. What company do you even work for - if any?

 

In short, don't antagonize us by trying to prove your superiority - we do hit back. Bring it on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

"Before I had ever played the game"? I don't need to play something to know whether or not it's going to be crap. Case in point - CFE. There are plenty of things that can be used to ascertain the quality of something, without having to spend four hours with it first. As for game magazines, I've never needed to take the advice of a

game review since I was about 7. By relying on my own intuition, I've never bought a poor game yet. How do you explain that? In fact it's the other way around. Any crap I've bought has been the magazines' fault. On the odd occasion I've punted on something (that I wouldn't have otherwise touched) based on all-round high review scores, I was right. Halo = 10 out of 10, Burnout 3 = 9 out of 10? Gimme a friggin' break...Game journalists = Absolute cretins.

 

You want to defend the press? Of course, they are fine when they are merely reporting on news, events and press releases, it’s when they attempt to think that it all goes downhill.

The best we have to offer in the west is ‘Edge’. Many gamers are apparently amazed at Edge magazine’s ‘insights’. In reality, much of its content is total tripe, regardless of the fact that it’s well-written. Edge hides the inadequacies it shares with all other games magazines behind its use of the written word. And to good effect. People will believe anything if its interspersed with a few adjectives they don’t understand.

 

Just because you cannot see how game journalists are wrong 90 percent of the time and that their opinions are almost exclusively ‘utter bullsh*t’ doesn’t mean nobody else can.

 

I don't expect for a second that you could understand what's wrong with MGS2 or anything else that's been over-rated beyond belief by the totally ignorant press. You have NO idea what it’s like to see the industry the way I do….oh wait… yes you do…you are on a forum……If I have no respect for professional game journalists how much respect do you think I reserve for people like you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You could just leave the forum now and I don't think anyone would mind.

 

We've been dealing with your high horse BS for a while now, including flames like that last one, and without any actual evidence of your great position in the industry. You've been asked several times, but never mentioned a game credit, company, or even a job title (other than a vague "designer," which could mean just about anything) that I can remember. I'll lay it out right here.. I worked for Sony Online Entertainment for about a year before going back to school for a degree, and have credits on at least two of the Everquest titles. My two best friends work for Sammy, and one previously worked at Activision, with credits on several games between them. Your turn?

 

Better yet, why don't you just get going. Anyone who's worked in the industry knows that "industry insiders" are, get this folks, just normal people. The good ones are gamers, the best ones are dreamers and do-ers, but they're not some mysterious group of elitist a******s like you. It sounds like you went to some school for game design and they probably taught you all kinds of theory and told you you were all set to be the best of the best. I got news for ya.. Like any abstract art form, video games are subjective. Games come from a combination of designers' minds and marketting's research, in varying proportion. It's usually pretty clear which got the lion's share, but you can't absolutely and universally quantify a game's experience based on this, game design theories, or any other criteria. Everyone gets their own experience out of a game, and no one person's opinion is any more valid than another's. You can sum it up a little if you pick a target audience, such as "rpg fans" or "girl gamers," but very few designers or companies make their games specifically for "elitist a******s," nor do reviewers write for them.

 

Reviewers write from a combination of personal experience, lack of personal experience, and monetary pressure. They are human like everyone else, and some are good and some are bad. To say "their opinions are almost exclusively ‘utter bullsh*t’" is ignorant at best, and to try to pass it off as some kind of high knowledge is the most utter bullsh*t of all. You're just another "guy on a forum" like the rest of us.

 

Pull the stick out or go away.

Edited November 30, 2004 by Daeval

[Skythe]

This game isn't that bad like everyone is claiming it to be. The only true gripe I have is that Capcom put Shin Akuma as a Street Fighter 2 character even though we now he never appeared in SF2.

 

Now a gripe towards game reviews (Specifically EGM). They give this game a mediocre score because it has classic gameplay (THAT WAS THE POINT, READ THE GOD DAMN BACK OF THE BOX!) but give great reviews for SVC because of classic gameplay (I like SVC so don't start with "uselessness".). Please tell me you see the hypocrisy here. That hypocrisy happens to be a form of bias as well.

 

Don't get me started on those game review shows Judgement Day and X Play. HORRIBLE!

[Wizard]

Akuma was the hidden boss in Street Fighter II Turbo.

 

Play magazine > all magazines.

[Gryph]

Akuma was the hidden boss in Street Fighter II Turbo.

 

Play magazine > all magazines.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

AAAAH!!! THE RETURN OF IAN LE...K'DASH!

[Inky]

If I have no respect for professional game journalists how much respect do you think I reserve for people like you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

well then like we say in the pen: "Kick rocks"

go on and piss off then if you don't like us. I know I won't miss you.

 

ank K' welcome back hope you stick around

[L.S.D]

Akuma was the hidden boss in Street Fighter II Turbo.

 

Play magazine > all magazines.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

AAAAH!!! THE RETURN OF IAN LE...K'DASH!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

K'Dash, when are you going to shaft Gryph and Fatal?

Welcome back!

[Skythe]

Akuma was the hidden boss in Street Fighter II Turbo.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Shin Akuma, not Akuma. As far as I know, Shin Akuma first appeared in SFA.

[shin_nihon_kikaku]

shin_nihon_kikaku Posted Today, 12:48 PM

  I told you when it was first announced that this game would suck ass and you were all falling over yourselves to defend it.

 

Still, now it's got a review score you believe it? Reviews should never be taken as gospel. I have little to no respect for game journalists, they don't understand the first thing about the subject matter.

 

My my, you have been bitchy lately, haven't you? always trying to prove us wrong and show us up...

 

We defended CFE against YOUR baseless attacks which you launched before you had ever played the game. Again you stereotype all reviewers and say they "don't understand" the subject matter - a ridiculous accusation. You are on a high-horse preaching about videogames from the point of view of "design concepts" and you don't understand the "art for the sake of art" or "labors of love" that are MGS2 and certainly CFE.

 

What kind of a game designer are you anyway? In the MGS2 review your discussion of your post seems less like an official position and more like 1 angry guy with twisted ideas. What company do you even work for - if any?

 

In short, don't antagonize us by trying to prove your superiority - we do hit back. Bring it on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

"Before I had ever played the game"? I don't need to play something to know whether or not it's going to be crap. Case in point - CFE. There are plenty of things that can be used to ascertain the quality of something, without having to spend four hours with it first. As for game magazines, I've never needed to take the advice of a

game review since I was about 7. By relying on my own intuition, I've never bought a poor game yet. How do you explain that? In fact it's the other way around. Any crap I've bought has been the magazines' fault. On the odd occasion I've punted on something (that I wouldn't have otherwise touched) based on all-round high review scores, I was right. Halo = 10 out of 10, Burnout 3 = 9 out of 10? Gimme a friggin' break...Game journalists = Absolute cretins.

 

You want to defend the press? Of course, they are fine when they are merely reporting on news, events and press releases, it’s when they attempt to think that it all goes downhill.

The best we have to offer in the west is ‘Edge’. Many gamers are apparently amazed at Edge magazine’s ‘insights’. In reality, much of its content is total tripe, regardless of the fact that it’s well-written. Edge hides the inadequacies it shares with all other games magazines behind its use of the written word. And to good effect. People will believe anything if its interspersed with a few adjectives they don’t understand.

 

Just because you cannot see how game journalists are wrong 90 percent of the time and that their opinions are almost exclusively ‘utter bullsh*t’ doesn’t mean nobody else can.

 

I don't expect for a second that you could understand what's wrong with MGS2 or anything else that's been over-rated beyond belief by the totally ignorant press. You have NO idea what it’s like to see the industry the way I do….oh wait… yes you do…you are on a forum……If I have no respect for professional game journalists how much respect do you think I reserve for people like you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You could just leave the forum now and I don't think anyone would mind.

 

We've been dealing with your high horse BS for a while now, including flames like that last one, and without any actual evidence of your great position in the industry. You've been asked several times, but never mentioned a game credit, company, or even a job title (other than a vague "designer," which could mean just about anything) that I can remember. I'll lay it out right here.. I worked for Sony Online Entertainment for about a year before going back to school for a degree, and have credits on at least two of the Everquest titles. My two best friends work for Sammy, and one previously worked at Activision, with credits on several games between them. Your turn?

 

Better yet, why don't you just get going. Anyone who's worked in the industry knows that "industry insiders" are, get this folks, just normal people. The good ones are gamers, the best ones are dreamers and do-ers, but they're not some mysterious group of elitist a******s like you. It sounds like you went to some school for game design and they probably taught you all kinds of theory and told you you were all set to be the best of the best. I got news for ya.. Like any abstract art form, video games are subjective. Games come from a combination of designers' minds and marketting's research, in varying proportion. It's usually pretty clear which got the lion's share, but you can't absolutely and universally quantify a game's experience based on this, game design theories, or any other criteria. Everyone gets their own experience out of a game, and no one person's opinion is any more valid than another's. You can sum it up a little if you pick a target audience, such as "rpg fans" or "girl gamers," but very few designers or companies make their games specifically for "elitist a******s," nor do reviewers write for them.

 

Reviewers write from a combination of personal experience, lack of personal experience, and monetary pressure. They are human like everyone else, and some are good and some are bad. To say "their opinions are almost exclusively ‘utter bullsh*t’" is ignorant at best, and to try to pass it off as some kind of high knowledge is the most utter bullsh*t of all. You're just another "guy on a forum" like the rest of us.

 

Pull the stick out or go away.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

 

Before you moan and groan, this isn’t an argument against your points, just my stance.

 

I don’t work at a games company and I haven’t avoided answering such a question. It’s you who hasn’t read what I’ve been saying. I AM STILL AT UNIVERSITY. I’ve stated this umpteen times.

 

Knowing whether something is good or not without having to play it, to go back to a point made earlier, is basically a question of company history. Edge may think that a useless, nobody company like Bungie responsible for such failures as the ‘Marathon’ series and ‘Oni’ can turn their fortunes around and come up with a masterpiece, but I don’t. To me, Halo is the ultimate poster boy for this. I see it as a complete mediocrity, but the press and consumers are blind to it. Companies can’t change their ways. I have never seen a single developer renowned for developing garbage or borderline average games, go on to create something extraordinary. It just isn’t going to happen. But at the preview stage, the press give every game a chance from despicable tripe like ‘Call of Duty’ and ‘Brothers in Arms’ to mass-market pap such as ‘Need for Speed Underground’ and the ‘Jak & Daxter’ series, just in case they end up embarrassed on the (incredibly minute) off-chance that a game they slated turns out to be exceptional. This carries over into their reviews of the finished titles. Almost every game the press reviews is over-rated. I have no idea how this can be the case, we’ve all seen and played truly exceptional games, we know they exist and what they are like and yet still the press insists that ‘Project Gotham Racing 2’ is an ‘eight out of ten’, or a ‘ninety-five percent’ or a ‘five out of five’….What the hell’s happening here, I don’t know.

 

I still stand by my opinions, however off-the-wall they may seem to you and whether anyone else can understand where I’m coming from or not. I’m not saying “I’m right and you’re wrong” but you’re not even listening to my point of view. In my eyes, magazines ARE on the whole incompetent. They’re okay for suggesting purchases to new gamers, but beyond that, I wouldn’t trust their reviews as far as they could spit.

 

Yes, games are subjective, in so much as the atmosphere, the concept and the style of game a particular person enjoys, but the quality of the experience and the developer’s talent and vision shouldn’t be open to subjection. It’s clear whether a game is good or not, whether a game should have been made or not. Much of the problem where the games press are concerned comes from the fact that, to me, almost every western game is hopelessly lacking and yet still gets high praise lauded upon it. On average, the game journalists’ standards just aren’t high enough. If they demanded better we wouldn’t have to endure all this garbage, all these utterly pointless releases, month after month, issue after issue. And all magazines are essentially the same. How can an entirely disparate group of magazines (if you based your thinking on magazines that review film, you would believe had different priorities and convictions), split down further into individual reviewers still arrive at one almost conclusive opinion for almost every game? This is exactly what happens – one only needs to look at the Game Rankings website to see that review scores, from magazine to magazine, around the world don’t drastically fluctuate. Films are also subjective, the difference is; a standard train of thought towards a particular film is far from achievable across the board. As for games, the press is wholeheartedly certifying the rubbish western developers continually serve up, so this is interpreted by the ‘creators’ not as “We need to drastically improve” but rather “let’s make sequels to the entirely futile Brothers in Arms”. According to the average score of all featured magazines and websites on Game Rankings The 50th best game of all time is Ratchet & Clank 3. 35th best is Burnout 3. Tony Hawk’s 3 is the 29th best. These games all have serious problems. How can this many reviewers have completely missed them? Because they hardly know what they’re doing. They don’t analyse. They sit there transfixed by mediocrity, just playing for fun, they're enjoying it but not realising what’s actually wrong with a game, they then have the cheek to come up with the self-same scapegoat problems such as ‘the camera isn’t up to scratch’ or ‘it’s too short’ or ‘it’s too easy’. These are wearing incredibly thin. Not once do I hear specifics that actually are to blame for screwing a product up. Burnout 3 has got a complete stinker. A blatant, glaring, truly despicable design atrocity that is specific to this game (but has appeared in a less intrusive way in a few other racing games and went un-detected there also), and not ONE review I’ve read has picked up on it. Needless to say the game gets all around nines…

 

As for the fact that journalists are just people. You're right. They aren't people who have been playing videogames since before they could talk. They aren't people who base their whole life around the art. They are just people who enjoyed playing games, went on to possess a journalism degree or a degree in English and consequently thought - "what better way to earn money than to play games and write some bumf about them". It should mean far more than this. The fact that they are blind to blatant flaws in almost every game they review proves it doesn't really mean a hell of a lot.

 

My monthly intake of the ramblings of the games press adds up to pretty conclusive proof that the games press are on average, not professional enough. Not by half.

Edited December 2, 2004 by shin_nihon_kikaku

[Agozer]

Stay on topic or put a sock in it; this isn't the place to go back and forth on why snk is full of it.