George W. Bush Is A Bumbling Moron

[miskie]

Oh, I forgot to add, to everyone, both eft and right leaning.. take a trip to the nonpartesan FactCheck.org ( http://factcheck.org ) and see the way both parties lie and stretch the truth about themselves and each other.

[miskie]

I don't support Bush...or anyone else for that matter.

But...at one point everyone was criticizing him for sending troops into Iraq...now they're criticizing him for not sending them soon enough...

this is typical -- and I agree lots aare saying we didnt use enough force to put down this rebel insugency in Iraq the first time.. During the first President Bush the Democrat-lead Congress would not give Bush Sr. the authority to Finish Saddam back then stating the goal was to get him out of Kuwait, and that was that.. then years later the Same Democrats complained that Bush Sr didnt finish the job, putting us in the mess we are in today.

 

As an Aside..

 

Although I havent heard anyone say this yet, Im sure this insurgency is because of what people think happened with Spain, that alittle terror changed a govt and got the new leader to swear that hell pull out of Iraq immediatly..

 

How true this angle is I dont really know or really care, however.. I think that this belief has lead lots of Iraqi resistance parties to beleieve that if they do some kidnapping and kill some civilians they can get other coalition members to leave Iraq as well. Which is stupid beyond words.

[BobRedthorp]

Sigh,

 

These types of forums should not have political discussion, it drags on and on and we all end up falling out.

[Gryph]

Sigh,

 

These types of forums should not have political discussion, it drags on and on and we all end up falling out.

Why not? This is the Current Affairs section and this is current affair.

 

And I agree with Miskie. It is important to look at all the facts, no matter what side of the political spectra you're from before you make arguements.

 

I should have posted factcheck.org earlier.

Edited April 15, 2004 by GryphonKlaw

[random guy]

Miskie, you're damn right that there's a double-standard in politics. but this is the first dime I've ever heard anyone say the Republicans are on the blunt end.

 

Case in point: Remember when it came out that Bill Clinton smoked weed in college? He actually had to say "I smoked, but i didn't inhale". And the right-wing press was baying for his blood. Bush, on the other hand, has ADMITTED to being ADDICTED to COCAINE for years, and no-one seems to be batting an eyeball about it.

 

In fact, all Clinton did was lie about getting a little action on the side, Bush has lied about getting elected (when he said the American people elected him  ), about serving time in the National Guard, about the reasons for sending his troops into the Iraq war, about whether he was told that the al Qaeda threat was real (he was told)....but who is moving to impeach him?

 

But it's the same with every right-wing Government. They can get away with raping funding to medical areas and schools, while pumping it into the military, and no-one seems to care. But if the left-wing even thinks about cutting the budget in important areas like medicine and education, the public would SCREAM about it, and the right-wing governments would be right at the front of the screaming line.

 

Personally, I think that that's because people who are left-wing are expected to be more morally upstanding than the right, but that's probably because I'm a raving leftie!

okay.. lots of answers coming...

 

Case in point: Remember when it came out that Bill Clinton smoked weed in college? He actually had to say "I smoked, but i didn't inhale". And the right-wing press was baying for his blood. Bush, on the other hand, has ADMITTED to being ADDICTED to COCAINE for years, and no-one seems to be batting an eyeball about it.

 

thats the difference between lying and telling the truth.

 

In fact, all Clinton did was lie about getting a little action on the side

with a few different women over several years, in front of a jury after taking an oath not to. he made his own situation worse, he could have said "yeah, Hillary some random intern and I have 3-ways all the time, and Sometimes I get done with a Strapon, So what ??" and that would have been the end of it.. (exaggerated for humor)

 

Bush has lied about getting elected (when he said the American people elected him  )

this is true, the Electoral College Elected him, as every single president before him -- We live in a Republic, not a Democracy

 

about serving time in the National Guard

This is false -- people have beaten this to death and have all of his records, icluding time served, his pay records, and wher he served. Granted he BARELY served enough to be honorably discharged, but he did meet his obligation, in a solid C-Student sort of way.

 

about the reasons for sending his troops into the Iraq war,

Not exactly -- If you view the video or read the transcript from the original speech, the War isnt all about WMD-- it became all about WMD later-- And now its back to the original premise, because Saddam and the Baath pary are a bunch of buttholes that might have WMDs as well

 

about whether he was told that the al Qaeda threat was real (he was told)

The 9-11 commission hasnt finished determining this yet So this may or may not be true

 

But it's the same with every right-wing Government. They can get away with raping funding to medical areas and schools, while pumping it into the military, and no-one seems to care.

and Clinton's Govt seems to be responsible for weakening the CIA/FBI to the point where 9/11 was able to happen, So he could free up money for those programs -- As a matter of fact apparantly one of the 9/11 commissoners is the one who made information-sharing between the FBI and the CIA impossible -- because of her own role, she has recused herself from voting on issues that she is directly involved in. Both the left and the right play to their bases. thats just the way it is.

 

Personally, I think that that's because people who are left-wing are expected to be more morally upstanding than the right, but that's probably because I'm a raving leftie!

perhaps you are, but, In my opinion, morality escapes both parties political leaders. they are greedy, interest serving, self absorbed folks with this annoying superhero complex. They all think they can save the world their political collegues make up "The Superfriends", and most think the other party is 'The legion of Doom' - its assinine.

 

I myself kinda walk the middle, Im Politically Conservative but Socially Liberal - I believe that a strong defence is vital, and that growing business at home is the way to make more jobs.. I believe that laws are there for a reason, However, I dont care what color or sex you are, I dont care if you are Straight, gay or Bisexual, and I dont care if you happen to be religious or not. And, I have bad things to say about both major parties

You know, I'd probably argue with you here, I could come up with a few points that'd be brilliant rebuffs: but you've caught me (or perhaps I've caught myself) at a time where I am...can i say this at an all-ages forum? I hope so...I'm drunk right now (sorry, kiddies! ). Maaan I'm intoxicated. I bet I'll regret this post in the morning. But there's one part of your post i particularly agree with. It is this comment;

 

I have bad things to say about both major parties

 

this is particularly true to me, probably because I am too radical for any left-wing government. Honestly, if there was a strong anarchist presence in australian politics I'd probably be behind that. But because us Aussies, just like you Yanks, have a bipartisan system, i find myself voting for the labor party (the equivalent of the democrats in your country) just as a way of getting rid of the right-wing Government that is currently in power. You know, the lesser of two evils kind of thing.

 

To be honest with you, I think that in 200 years or so, we will look back on this "democracy" we have as an archaic form of Government, equivalent to Feudalism or fascism. Democracy has failed us, people, if only because it has been raped by Capitalism, and we need to move on.

 

Really, though, democracy is an archaic concept. It was invented thousands of years ago, when the ancient Greeks ruled the world. Can we truly not have come up with a better, more representative form of government, even after 2000 years+? Especially with the insane new representative powers that the Internet grants us. could you imagine if you had the right to vote for or against ANY new law that comes into power? Not just for the politicians that push the laws into parliament. If every citizen of a country had a TRUE say in a law that has national importance, THAT would be a true democratic process. Instead of having politicians that represent a particular state, if EVERYONE could vote for every law and government mandate going through parliament, then we'd have true representation in politics. That way, people would be more confident in politics, would (hopefully) vote more in countries such as the US where voting is voluntary, and in the process we would lose alot of the rivalry that comes with politics. I mean, lets face it, the original argument here was whether a sexual deviant or a pathological-liar/perpetual moron was a better leader! Who would be better to represent a country than ITS INHABITANTS?

 

I apologise if I have been too radical here, I usually take great care to moderate my views so they are non-offensive to the average message-board poster (I mean I have stated a view that would probably get me arrested under the new anti-terrorism laws that are taking effect in your country and mine). But I have been caught off guard. It is important to realise that I AM NOT A TERRORIST, just a citizen of the world who happens to be highly unsatisfied by the state of politics today.

[miskie]

Sigh,

 

These types of forums should not have political discussion, it drags on and on and we all end up falling out.

political discussions can be cool, as long as people discuss their views in a civilized way and it doesent degrade into an obscenity-war.. SO far, Im pleased with the way all this has been going because it hasnt sunk into bitter squabbles.

 

And, honestly, In The USA, and because of the War on Terrorism, most of the world is interested in how the US Elections are fairing this year, So, IMO, it fits well in the Current Affairs Section.

 

 

Hell, Random Guy is way Left and Im just Right of Center -- I dont see either of us getting into it with Pitchforks or BFG10Ks -- its civil, and its cool -- discussions like this are the only way IMO to keep from falling into closedmindedness on lots of issues

[BoomBa_GoosE]

i just believe that after all this thats goin on in the US, and with the presidential approval poll goin down, i think bush is lost more than ever. he doesnt kno what to do with the re-elections comin up. our president was not ready for this position in my opinion.

[random guy]

In a December profile, The Washington Post examined the breezy American history curriculum being sold to schools by presidential brother Neil Bush (more in the news lately for his messy divorce). The course's premise is that future "hunter-gatherers" (i.e., rambunctious boys) don't have the patience to read and should be taught by music, graphics and other techniques. For instance, the Constitutional Convention of 1787 is taught in a rap song, "It was 55 delegates from 12 states/Took one hot Philadelphia summer to create/A perfect document for their imperfect times/Franklin, Madison, Washington, a lot of the cats/Who used to be in the Continental Congress way back." [Washington Post, 12-27-03]

 

Oh god, it looks like Bush and his family are now trying to make the rest of America as stoopid as he is!

[miskie]

In a December profile, The Washington Post examined the breezy American history curriculum being sold to schools by presidential brother Neil Bush (more in the news lately for his messy divorce). The course's premise is that future "hunter-gatherers" (i.e., rambunctious boys) don't have the patience to read and should be taught by music, graphics and other techniques. For instance, the Constitutional Convention of 1787 is taught in a rap song, "It was 55 delegates from 12 states/Took one hot Philadelphia summer to create/A perfect document for their imperfect times/Franklin, Madison, Washington, a lot of the cats/Who used to be in the Continental Congress way back." [Washington Post, 12-27-03]

 

Oh god, it looks like Bush and his family are now trying to make the rest of America as stoopid as he is!

Its just a continuation of the Ebonics Movement of the 90's -- Being somewhat connected to the Education system in America I can Tell some horror Stories about how far Education has degraded. Here are a few...

 

1) Kids have the constitutional right to fail --- pfft -- I believe along with your rights go responsibility, and this is just irresponsible

 

2) The Removal of Phonics from early Education in exchange for the 'whole Language' approach. Kids learn to read whole words and not how words are made, so when they come across an unfamiliar word, they cant read it, or even figure out how to pronounce it

 

3) Ebonics -- There is nothing better than further fracturing an already fractured language, why not go all the way and make Latinics, Asianics and Euronics as well ?

 

4) Spelling Doesnt count in some school systems anymore -- Soe spehl gud is ohk

 

5) "Equal Rights" in history texts -- I can understand this approach for recent history, however, early American history is almost 100% old white rich men with a few notable exceptions, nothing like rewriting the past..

 

6) Over-the-top political correctness -- when a bunch of young school children go on an Oval-hunt instead of an Easter-Egg hunt one may be carrying PC alittle too far.

 

7) There are no winners or losers -- kids play games and everyone wins.. yeah, thats preparing them for real life alright..

 

8.) because of Poor SAT results, the Standard scoring was Scaled about 10 years ago to make it all better

 

At this point there is half a generation of undereducated kids --kids that are unprepared for real-life... You do know who was in charge of the USA when all these changes took place, Don't you ?

[Weirdy]

In a December profile, The Washington Post examined the breezy American history curriculum being sold to schools by presidential brother Neil Bush (more in the news lately for his messy divorce). The course's premise is that future "hunter-gatherers" (i.e., rambunctious boys) don't have the patience to read and should be taught by music, graphics and other techniques. For instance, the Constitutional Convention of 1787 is taught in a rap song, "It was 55 delegates from 12 states/Took one hot Philadelphia summer to create/A perfect document for their imperfect times/Franklin, Madison, Washington, a lot of the cats/Who used to be in the Continental Congress way back." [Washington Post, 12-27-03]

 

Oh god, it looks like Bush and his family are now trying to make the rest of America as stoopid as he is!

talk about sublibable!!

 

[nicknicknickandnick]

Its just a continuation of the Ebonics Movement of the 90's  -- Being somewhat connected to the Education system in America I can Tell some horror Stories about how far Education has degraded. Here are a few...

 

1) Kids have the constitutional right to fail  --- pfft -- I believe along with your rights go responsibility, and this is just irresponsible

 

2) The Removal of Phonics from early Education in exchange for the 'whole Language' approach. Kids learn to read whole words and not how words are made, so when they come across an unfamiliar word, they cant read it, or even figure out how to pronounce it

 

3) Ebonics -- There is nothing better than further fracturing an already fractured language, why not go all the way and make Latinics, Asianics and Euronics as well ?

 

4) Spelling Doesnt count in some school systems anymore -- Soe spehl gud is ohk

 

5) "Equal Rights"  in history texts --  I can understand this approach for recent history, however, early American history is almost 100% old white rich men with a few notable exceptions, nothing like rewriting the past..

 

6) Over-the-top political correctness -- when a bunch of young school children go on an Oval-hunt instead of an Easter-Egg hunt one may be carrying PC alittle too far.

 

7) There are no winners or losers -- kids play games and everyone wins.. yeah, thats preparing them for real life alright.. 

 

8.) because of Poor SAT results, the Standard scoring was Scaled about 10 years ago to make it all better

 

At this point there is half a generation of undereducated kids --kids that are unprepared for real-life... You do know who was in charge of the USA when all these changes took place, Don't you ?

 

Oh my lord, number 6 is just awful! I mean, I at least heard of the other ones. It would be better if that was just some joke that got passed around as truth, but I wouldn't be too surprised that someone tried to do an "oval hunt" for real.

 

In Canada, there is no national education curriculum, as each province is responsible for the details of education. I'm pretty sure it's like that in the US too, which is why we hear about some district somewhere pushing creation science silliness. I don't know how much a national leader can do with specifics, as there are "states' rights" involved.

 

That whole language philosophy has been over-pushed on us for decades, at least back to the 60s from what I have read. Lucky for me it wasn't really pushed in my area in a big way when I first learned to read. One year I even had a nun (this one was not an insane disciplinarian like you may have heard of) for a teacher and I recall lots of learning about short and long vowel sounds and so on. Every elementary year, I had regular spelling tests.

 

Much later, I took some linguistics courses, and I really appreciate the value of knowing about phonemes and how different languages have different sounds and grammars and so on. It would have helped me learn French in high school, rather than the horrible texts with just pictures and French words where I had to guess what was meant.

Edited April 16, 2004 by nicknicknickandnick